Battlestar Galactica

[Telfer]

So, spoilers abound.

I never read that other thread about BSG. I only started watching via Netflix this year. I'm all caught up with the DVDs, and I've "obtained" Season 3. But I've only watched the first episode.

Can I just say what the frack? You can't be serious. They threw the whole plot away for this refugee crap and I'm way not into it. I thought using the "one year later" device was total crap at the end of Season 2.5. But then! At the beginning of Season 3 they fast forward ANOTHER year? Oh my my. I feel totally screwed as an audience.

Now, I will probably watch the rest of the episodes, but while I tore through the mini-series and first two seasons, I'm going to be very casual about catching up with Season 3.

On one hand, props to them for keeping on with the risk taking. And Dean Stockwell and Lucy Lawless as Cylons? Beyond brilliant. I'm sure the heart of the creative team is still alive and if I stick with it I'll be happy. I just did a play where the director and actors were constantly freaking out about certain episodes of Season 3 and I was sooo jealous. But now I'm kind of not. I kind of think it's crap. Anyone care to taunt me back into watching? Again, just one episode of Season 3 and I'm ready to pack it in. Maybe when it's officially released on DVD I'll Netflix it, but I kind of feel like my show died.

I mean seriously! Everyone's randomly married? Lee Adama in a Santa fat suit? It's like an SNL skit. A current SNL skit.

[VinRigan]

Give 'em a few more episodes, and they'll get past it. Not my favorite season thus far, but not bad, either. By the end of the season, you'll have forgiven them for the "one year later" junk- which was a bit of a turnoff for me, too. Plus, there are multiple flashbacks throughout the season, so you'll get to see a lot of what actually happens in that year.

[sammy]

It pays off.

[Chip]

Telfer, don't forget to check out the webisodes I told you about. They are shorts that cover some of what the resistance has been up to.

Do like Tony says and stick with it. In retrospect, I'm glad they did what they did because frankly, I want them to get on with it - the show is called Battlestar Galactica, not The New Caprica Refugees. They take enough time on the planet as it is, so I forgive them the time jumps in order to get to the meat of the story.

So, do please keep watching. There's some interesting stuff coming up.

Upcoming season 4 is most probably the last season, so I say stick with it and see it through.

-Chip

[Telfer]

I also hate flashbacks! Grr! We'll see- the webisodes thing might be cool, but it might also function like the Star Wars animated series and I might just get mad that they aren't a part of the real timeline. Why couldn't they put that material in the actual show? Arrg!

[schaefe]

It wasn't a year...it was four months into the Cylon occupation. Geez.

Don't be a hater. I thought that 3rd season, as a whole, rocked out.

[Telfer]

The difference between 4 months and 12 months is marginal as far as character development goes. You still miss a lot of important shit. It smelled like a producer getting sick of his show and trying to squeeze out his favorite ideas for the plot before he cuts and runs.

[Arnie]

I would have to say that overall, the third season was the weakest, but, for me, the flashing forward was one of the best things they did. Time passes and we don't need to see everything. And we are given enough clues to fill in the gaps on our own. Many of my favorite shows use this technique (usually between seasons): 24, Sopranos, the Wire. It never really seemed like a cheat or gimmicky to me, like, say, the lost two years on Alias.

At the same time, for better or for worse, television is about retaining the status quo, so most shows, no matter how much they pretend to break or shatter the formula ("oh shit, this totally changes everything forever!") tend to get back to business as usual faster than you'd guess. The same holds for BSG.

[robbersean]

They needed to go to New Caprica, and they needed the flash forward.

I look at like a group game in a Harold. They're flying through space, they fight Cylons, Lee and Kara have a messed up relationship. After two seasons, of that, things would've started to get stale if they had just kept the status quo. So they switched it up for a few episodes. We see all of these characters in a different situation, see some new facets to who they are, so when we do get back to flying through space, fighting Cylons, and Lee and Kara screaming at each other (or boxing) there's a newness to all of it.

My only criticism of this season was that they grouped all of the stand alone episodes together. Dirty Hands, Taking a Break from all Your Worries, and the Woman, King didn't all need to be one right after the other. I mean, those weren't bad episodes, but they just didn't feel needed to the overall storyline, so I didn't care about them quite so much.

I loved the season finale. I think the last five minutes of that last episode stands up to every other great moment that the shows had, including the showdown between the two Battlestars during the Pegasus three-parter.

[schaefe]

The difference between 4 months and 12 months is marginal as far as character development goes. You still miss a lot of important shit. It smelled like a producer getting sick of his show and trying to squeeze out his favorite ideas for the plot before he cuts and runs.

Renewed for a 22 episode 4th season though...no cutting and running here. :cool:

[Telfer]

How much longer does Apollo wear the santa suit? That's become my new deciding factor.

I mean, he's even wearing what appears to be latex jowels.

[schaefe]

like 3-4 episodes in to the season. Then he has a training montage to "Eye of the Tiger" with Helo, and he is back to his normal svelte self...

[schaefe]

The santa suit is actually Sharon's pregnancy getup from the 2nd season...they wanted to save some money on props...

[Telfer]

Sammy, I have to repost this now you nutbar.

So we finished Season 3 of Battlestar Galactica via the internet. Some things:

1) Meniere's Disease means you're a cylon?
2) President's aide sure got a rush job of "this is an important character" before they reveal her Meniere's.
3) 4 out of the final 5 are all Galactica survivors? The only way that makes any sense is if the cylons intentionally allowed this ship to survive. Galactica has had enough close calls with destruction that I call BS. There's a lot of "there's no such thing as a coincidence" talk on this show, but if these 4 people are all part of the fraction of 1% that survived the nuclear onslaught, this show takes "destiny" a little too seriously.
4) Dumbest music for a montage ever in the finale.
5) I like that Caprica Six is trying to telecommunicate with Hera, but they threw that pretty slapdash into the finale. We have plenty of cliffhangers, people.
6) Lee goes on a huge rant in court. Fine, cool, whatevs. He makes a huge deal out of the President's general pardon though. Um, bullshit? If you're the prosecutor, how do you not remind the court that the general pardon was issued when Baltar was on a Cylon Basestar actively assisting them in their search for Earth? Give me a break. His not-guilty verdict felt pretty weak if it's based on this. Even the quorum should have picked up on that in deliberations. But no, let's keep Whiney McPlotpoint alive another season.
7) "You missed, butterfingers!" Oh lord that was hilarious.
8) Is there a cover band called "Kara Thrace and her Special Destiny" yet? If not, I call lead vocals.



(accidentally edited instead of quoted. Sigh. -sammy)

[sammy]

1) Meniere's Disease means you're a cylon?
It means you're one of the Final Five, which looks like you're a very different kind of cylon. I'd wager the "cycles of history" thing will be explored as they get closer to Earth--Starbuck as descendant of the 13th colony, Final Five as descendants/remnants of original cylons.

2) President's aide sure got a rush job of "this is an important character" before they reveal her Meniere's.
Well, if a former Aide didn't bail on the show to shoot a Pilot...that didn't get picked up... I think they gave Tory enough face time in S2 and S3 to warrant her cylonitude. Obviously would have been so much cooler had it been lil' ol' Billy.

4) Dumbest music for a montage ever in the finale.
Arguable.

7) "You missed, butterfingers!" Oh lord that was hilarious.
Great, great line.

8) Is there a cover band called "Kara Thrace and her Special Destiny" yet? If not, I call lead vocals.
You are the gajillionith person to say this. Besides, the name is taken for my next improv project...

[Telfer]

I didn't know he left the show. That makes sense. His girlfriend hooking up with Lee was le forced, though.

Starbuck as a descendant of the 13th colony? Maybe. I hadn't bothered to think about her thing too much. I just figured she was some kind of oracle, except a stealth oracle I guess since she doesn't wear robes and take drugs like the other ones on the show.

My current theory (based on the Temple of Five episode and the finale) is that the final five are Cylons that remain in some kind of hibernation every 4000 years, or every 4000 years they come of of some kind of stasis. That Cylons have been around since Kobol, and these models are secret because they only come out when society is on the brink of collapse again and both humans and Cylons are in danger as species. So Kobol was once a 13th colony, and Earth is going to be the new Kobol.

See if that doesn't give you a nerd hangover.

[sammy]

His girlfriend hooking up with Lee was le forced, though.

I guess due to time constraints, they had to keep cutting the "budding relationship" footage, which only made the Dualla-falls-into-Lee's-bed thing all the more hinky.

Who listens to all the podcasts?

This guy.

[Forsythe]

Kobol isn't a 13th colony. It's where the all originated. It's the Pangea of Battlestar Galactica. Then for whatever reason - angering the Gods I guess - they were forced off Kobol and the Kobolians went to 12 different planets that became the 12 different colonies. But then we find out in ancient texts that just before the mass exodus, a 13th colony left before everyone (wouldn't that make them the 1st colony?) and went to Earth. Why the lore just doesn't say, "a 13th colony left before everyone and dissappeared" I don't know because obvious, if they say they settled Earth, then someone must have traveled from Earth back to Kobol to let everyone one know that that's where the 13th colony settled. But then I guess everyone decided to keep it a secret and turned that story into BG myth.

[Telfer]

Jon, I've watched the whole series (all in the last 2 months actually) so I'm aware of Kobol not being a 13th colony... according to what we already know. I'm aware of all doors my wackball theory opens. The Gods didn't get angered or whatever in my theory- it was just the end of that refuge planet. The history of the previous "cycle" lost.

I stand by my theory as nothing in the series directly contradicts it, and it would be a cool tie-in to the Cylons' ramblings about cyclical history.

[schaefe]

I've heard that theory in reverse, actually.

Everyone came from Earth originally, and settled on Kobol. "Something really bad happened", and the colonists left Kobol, and founded the 12 Colonies. Before the "Really bad things happened", a large group of peeps stood up and said, "This is bullshit! We are going back to Earth, and following the signposts that we left on our way to Kobol, so F-You guys."

So, actually the "rag tag fleet" is going back to where it all started originally.

Anyway, that's what I heard.

I actually liked the music choice in the season ender. I thought it was a nice touch.

[Telfer]

I love that Schaefe! I love old things. When I was in England for the first time last year, I was fawning over old castles like they were made of heroin. I'm such a sucker for that stuff, as well as sciencey stuff like the biology/motivation of the Cylons. So even when this show infuriates me, I remain hooked!

I love theorizing this stuff. But, you know, I couldn't bear going to a sci-fi message board because those people are fucking <i>nerds</i>.

[schaefe]

I hear ya. I once spent over four hours standing in the middle of a bridge that Caesar's Legionaries built outside of Salamanca in Spain during the Civil War.

2,100 years old, and can support a duece and a half rolling over it. Old stuff is awesome.

[Telfer]

I knew you would understand Schaefe. If anyone's a history nerd...

[Bowman]

Yes, season 3 was woefully uneven, but I loved the last few episodes. I think Ron Moore maps out the beginning and end to every season and lets his less talented nephew handle all the stand-alone episodes.

The "resolution" to the New Caprica storyline is replete with badass special effects, so I forgive it.

[Chip]

Season 3 gag reel (possible season 3 spoilers) (not safe for work)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdmo_KCsutI

-Chip

[sammy]

The first BSG: Razor teaser (the BSG movie coming out in Nov before Season 4). It focuses on the Pegasus during the aftermath of the Cylon attack.

http://video.scifi.com/player/?id=127692

[sammy]

Razor Preview Clip 2

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[sammy]

I'm enjoying the little mini-sodes currently out.

The newest one, number 3, made me smile since it had the old flying wings and classic basestars.

I think young adama is trying too hard to channel his inner batman though :)

http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/

[Chip]

I think he's just trying hard to be similar to EJO's voice, and it's a little low for him.

-Chip

[timalimdim]

Yeah, the voice is a little bale-as-batman, but he looks the part. I can believe that he'll look like Adama one day (he's even got the pitty face that makes us love EJO), but he also looks a lot like Lee.

Good little webisodes.

[Hendo]

Wow, those three flashbacks rock. First, "Husker" Adama is putting it to some hot chick pilot, then half her face is blown off, then he's up fighting Cylons. In a total of 15 minutes, real time. They ain't screwin' around.

The best part was the destruction of the Columbia and Adama's reaction to it... especially his hearing the screams of the crew as it exploded.

[RonK]

When is Season 3 out on disk? I finaly nexflixed & bought seasons 1 & 2...so I need to catch up before season 4 starts (when?).

Razor comes out on DVD Dec.4....but no mention I can find about S3.

Sammy...get on this.

[Telfer]

Nice spoilers Hendo.

[Hendo]

is it a spoiler if it happened 41 years ago, though?

[rkozlowski]

That's a little crazy, isn't it?

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/showtracker/2007/10/battlestar-gala.html

[Telfer]

AND there's a mid-season break?

I would be less irritated if there was more good television.

[sammy]

newest minisode

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[Chip]

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j101/microchip2222/cylond.jpg

[Gass]

Free Screening Monday, November 12th in Chicago & Evanston.

http://www.battlestarevent.com/

[Jels]

Free Screening Monday, November 12th in Chicago & Evanston.

http://www.battlestarevent.com/


Registration is closed for all Chicago locations.

[Chip]

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j101/microchip2222/razor.jpg

[sammy]

Through the bits that are torrented I caught BSG: Razor. Very solid, very enjoyable. No spoilers:

Great seeing Cain, Fisk and Thorn again...even Laird! Also nice seeing the retro cylons, although I wish they would have folded the Adama flashbacks into the full movie. I would rate this as the equivalent of a superior two-part episode and highly recommend DVRing it--I can't imagine what it would be like to watch it chock full of commercials (run time of 1h27m).


eta:
This made me wish for BSP one-off season, pre-BSG encounter, like an 8-episode arc or so.

[sammy]

found on the sci fi boards:

The DVD cut is 101 minutes long, while the TV cut is 84 minutes long. The DVD cut will include Adama's flashbacks and Cain's flashbacks concerning her family during the first Cylon War.

[Chip]

Sammy, was the version you saw the TV or DVD version?

-Chip

[sammy]

TV. I definitely wanted to see more, which is why I'm glad there will be a full DVD version.

[Gass]

Anyone going to Evanston for the 10pm showing tonight?

[Mr. Keith]

I'm half way through it right now, and it's great.

What I could do without are these Quizno's sponsored "It's been revealed..." segments at each commercial break. I just saw it. It was revealed to me. I don't need someone telling me what I just saw. It's like sitting with a little kid who happens to sound like The Voice of Sci-Fi Channel.

[Mr. Keith]

Yep. The whole episode was pretty good.

I'm glad I went and watched the regular episodes about Pegasus beforehand, if just to get the whole story on Admiral Cain, even though I'm glad it still didn't turn into The Michelle Forbes Show.

And was "Razor" just a metaphor? I assumed it played a bigger role to be in the title, but I guess I hadn't really thought enough about it.

But I'm always a fan of inner-continuity stuff that plays off what time it's in and what it leads to in the actual story. Being a reader of comics throughout the 90's, that's pretty much what every issue was sometimes. I especially liked the parallels with what Galactica went through and how each ship had handled it and why.

I even seem to now recall a Pegasus counterpoint with Tyrol for a quick scene. Are we going to find out he has a twin brother out there. Oh wait, we already seem to have a reason to think that.

It was also great to see the callback to the original show by showing the old Cylons. I never watched it back in the day (and something tells me I wouldn't be a fan) but I can respect a good shout out to the hardcore base. One of the best things about Battlestar Galactica is how well they've effortlessly maintained their connection with the original show. Although it does take a special actor to pull off saying "frak" in a natural way, but that seems to be something everyone's had to get used to.

Are we going to see those Ewok-lookin' teddy bears re-imagined now? Because this show now has my faith that they could fit them in and pull it off. But let's not make it a priority.

Does the DVD have much more to it? I can't imagine that they cut out so much that this extra footage is going to add anything earthshattering.

Oh, and it could've used more Baltar, but he's my favorite character (but it's a close race). I guess, if you think about it, he was pretty busy during all this.

But, yeah, two thumbs up.

[sammy]

The DVD has 17 more minutes, 7 of which could be the remaining Young Bill Adama (the death of the Columbia and the skydive shootout) and 10 more
of Young Helena Cain and why she hates the Cylons so much.

[Chip]

I thought this was a great bridge to show Pegasus's journey with her crew. I thought the title of Razor was apt, what with Cain's speech about the knife. It was basically a metaphor of how Pegasus had gotten through the war so far, how she had as well.

I'm impressed how much of the tidbits dropped about Pegasus

I thought the stuff with Six and Cain was interesting. Gives more meaning to the fact that she was so ruthless in interrogating Six.

And the story of the ship with the FTL drives was hard to watch. They definitely showed what a hard situation that was.

And the shooting of the first XO for refusing an order in a time of war.


So what do people think about the hybrid's deal with Starbuck leading them on the path to the apocalypse? It'd be too easy to say "oh, he's a Cylon. He's trying to trick them." I think there's definitely more to it than that. Can't wait for March!

-Chip

[schaefe]

I'm half way through it right now, and it's great.

What I could do without are these Quizno's sponsored "It's been revealed..." segments at each commercial break. I just saw it. It was revealed to me. I don't need someone telling me what I just saw. It's like sitting with a little kid who happens to sound like The Voice of Sci-Fi Channel.

You and me both. Sooo lame.

From Shortpacked.com:

http://www.shortpacked.com/

[robbersean]

I really liked this special, but I love almost anything Battlestar Galactica at this point.

I loved seeing the classic Cylons show up, and I hope they show up again. It was neat to see Lee put to the test as commander. I really liked Kendra Shaw, and I kind of wanted her to stick around, but the way she died was really cool, and cryptic at the same time. Helena Cain is also a bad ass. A horrible, horrible person, but a bad ass.

I think Lee Adama is a cylon. I don't know how, as he's the Old Man's son, but I think he is.

[Chip]

The obvious answer is that Starbuck is the Cylon, because she blew up and now she's back. But that's such an obvious conclusion to come to that I bet it's wrong.

They really hit on the "all this has happened before, and all this will happen again" phrase. Is that just a sort of rebirth theme, that humanity will be reborn on Earth, or something more specific, I wonder? Reminds me of the improv mantra, "the end is in the beginning". Maybe Battlestar Galactica is a Harold. ;)

-Chip

[Biddle]

I am slowly catching up to you guys. I've been borrowing box sets and renting disks to get caught up to everyone. (This weekend, I watched 2.0 and the first disk of 2.5). My goal is to get disks of Season 3 when it comes out and be totally caught up before Season 4 begins.

I can't believe how consistently strong this show is. Nearly every episode in the second half of 2.0 has a very serious, "OH SHIT" moment. The whole Pegasus storyline was incredible. The Resurrection Ship storyline. Both Adama and Cain plotting each others death was incredible.

I am really, REALLY enjoying this series. I can't believe how good it is.

Just wanted to chime into the discussion,

COB

[sammy]

Just wait until the Galactica transforms into a giant robot and blasts the Zentradi fleet.

[Biddle]

WHAT?!?

SAMMY NO!!

SPOILER ALERT, DUDE, SPOILER ALERT!

Now I have to act all surprised when the Zentradi show up.

Goddamn you, Sammy.

COB out...

[Telfer]

Harold is a cylon.

[Biddle]

Harold is a cylon.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Now, I'll be watching his performance, thinking, "He's TOTALLY a Cylon!"

On a related note, I saw "The Farm" episode over the weekend and instantly thought, "That doctor is TOTALLY a cylon". He was giving creep factors, level 10, there.

It would be a pretty sweet gig to get cast as one of the 12 human cylons. You know you're going to get a ton of camera time, playing multiple versions of your character. I bet they're pretty jazzed when they get cast now.

Cheers,
COB

[schaefe]

Season 3 DVD release apparently is not scheduled until April of 2008, so you have a couple more months yet....

[Chip]

Season 4 starts in March. So you may want to bit torrent season 3 so you can catch up before season 4 starts.

-Chip

[Telfer]

I meant the longform, not Sammy's avatar. But whatevs.

[Biddle]

That's Piss Poor planning on the Sci Fi channel's part. Release season 3 AFTER Season 4 begins? That's Rucking Fetarded!

I'll see what I can do to come up with the episodes before the season begins. Otherwise, I'll just DVR the first half of Season 4, rent all of the Season 3 disks when they come out, blast through them in one weekend, and then get caught up on Season 4.

Shows this good, I actually prefer to watch in 4 - 5 episode chunks. (I do the same thing with Lost, Mad Men and Rescue Me.) So that might pay off here.

I honestly can't believe how phenomenally well-written this show is. Isn't this the remake of the show that had a guy dressed up as a robot-dog? Yeah, well, talk about improving the source material with the remake. I am now a huge, HUGE fan of the show.

Cheers nerds,
COB

[sammy]

Here be a Ron Moore interview. (http://scifipulse.net/battlestarnews/RDM_Dec_07.html)

[Sleeps]

I'll see what I can do to come up with the episodes before the season begins. Otherwise, I'll just DVR the first half of Season 4, rent all of the Season 3 disks when they come out, blast through them in one weekend, and then get caught up on Season 4.

You can just buy all of season 3 on iTunes for ~$40. Worth it to be caught up in my opinion.

[sammy]

Season 3 DVD release date: March 25th

(finally!)

[sammy]

Season 4 preview from Space

oh. my.

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[RonK]

For your Birthday Sammy


http://www.lifeformz.com/weblog/uploaded_images/cylon-797954.jpg

[frankandbeans]

finally rented and saw razor last week. fricking awesome. what incredible casting they have on that show. new main girl introduced, instant crush of millions of fans. like every time on that show! the cool as a cucumber asian with an aussie accent. wow.

[sammy]

DVD release bumped up by a week. (http://www.tvshowsondvd.com/news/Battlestar-Galactica-Season-3-Menus/8860)

[Aaroneous]

well yeah but is it going to be like $40 for one half of the season and $40 for the other half, like season 2? or are they packaging it all together (for $150 i'm sure)? i haven't read the dvd details, clearly.

and didn't i already DL all of season 3 on itunes? sammy, i love BSG and i love you, but why do i need the dvds?

also was it your bday? happy (belated) bday!

a

[sammy]

Season 3 DVDs out next week.

Season 4 starts April 4th.

oh dear.

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[IreneM]

I'm really late to this thread - I want to comment on the Kobol/Earth conversation from the first couple of pages.

One of the main themes of the show seems to be the cycle of history (Six is always saying what happened before will happen again) and within the series itself there are events that happen that are similar to things that happened earlier on. (One of the ones that is coming to mind is the tomb of Athena and Temple of Five - notice how the cylons were on the path to the Temple and the humans were blowing them up in a mirror to what had happened on Kobol with the tomb?)

I think that Earth is the new Kobol and in 4,000 years (after the cylon and human lines have merged and then separated again) when the cylons are on the run from human genocide they will look for the mythical Kobol.

WHO IS THE FINAL CYLON?!!?

[Chip]

Well, after the events that happened to Starbuck, you have to wonder if she's the final Cylon. After all, she blew up in that nebula/vortex thingy, right? And then miraculously she returns alive and well. So that easily causes suspicion.

But that's too easy, right? Another argument could be made for Baltar because of that psychic link between him and Six - could that be a latent Cylon programming affecting him? I kind of doubt that because the interplay between him and Six works better thematically as an interplay of forbidden love a la the Montegues and Capulets of Romeo and Juliet.

So who does that really leave? I feel like Adama is out because he has a son, Lee, who would be half-cylon, and that would screw up all the mythology behind Sharon and Helo's baby. Likewise, Lee isn't a cylon because we know Adama is his father.

President Roslyn could be one, I guess, but that'd be strange to make her and her assistant cylons.

At this point, making Gaeta a cylon is a joke, right? But I guess it could be him.

Tom Zarek?

I don't know. I have a feeling it's Starbuck.

-Chip

[robbersean]

I really think it's Lee. I don't quite understand the hows or the whys of it, but then I don't understand the hows or whys of Tigh being a Cylon either. I'm sure it'll all be explained.

Two hints that Lee is Cylon #12:

1- In Season 1, Leobehn tells Roslyn that "Adama is a Cylon" she assumes he means the Old Man, but he never said which Adama he was talking about. We know that the Leobehn cylons use nuggets of truth to manipulate people.

2- In the webisode/ minisodes for Razor, at the very end, they show a flashback where Doral (a Cylon) states Lee is being transferred to Galactica right before the attack. It just seems like way too big of a coincidence that Lee would be transferred at that time, AND Doral was the one who told Bill Adama that Lee was being transferred.

Cylon #12= Lee.

[IreneM]

We're operating on the assumption of spoilers in all of these posts right? If not, now we are.

I think Starbuck's true self is different - maybe she is a type of Oracle and who knows, that Nebula may not have blown her up as much as transported her to another place. Maybe she had an end of 2001-type experience out there. My question about starbuck is what did her mother know about her destiny and was she consciously preparing her for her destiny? Who is her father? How many episodes until they trust her to take them to earth? I can easily see her being martyred - Gaius seems too obvious a choice for a christ figure but i wouldn't put it past them to give Starbuck a glorious death.

I do not think Gaius is a cylon - he's probably the most human character on the series. He's too driven by impulse, fear and self preservation. I think he's going to be revealed as the one god the cylons pray to and the cylons are going to be revealed as the gods the humans pray to.

I can definitely see the argument for Lee as a cylon and Admiral Adama's flashback in Razor could be used to support that theory. I can think of no better way for Lee to further humiliate his father than to wind up a cylon.

I also wouldn't be surprised if everyone slowly died at the end (maybe the atmosphere isn't right!) and the only survivers were the two human/cylon children. Come on biblical!

[rdolan]

At work, sometimes Irene has these conversations with herself in the lunch room. She switches chairs to make counterpoints.

Nobody hangs out in the lunch room anymore.

[IreneM]

Someday you'll watch and then you'll be sorry for the teasing and sorry for the life you led without it.

This is OUR march madness ok? Just give us this corner of the world.

[sammy]

Caprica prequel movie/backdoor pilot approved! (http://www.variety.com/article/VR1117982614.html?categoryid=14&cs=1&p=0)

[sammy]

Nice Season 4 preview clip can be found here (http://io9.com/369909/why-battlestar-galactica-is-the-best-political-drama-on-tv).

[lackadaisy]

The cast will be doing the Top Ten list on Letterman tonight! <a href="http://www.scifi.com/scifiwire/index.php?id=50290">Link</a>

[John P. Glynn]

These were mostly lame except for Col. Tigh's delivery, but it was cool to see the gang (including a mysteriously well-groomed Baltar dressed like Hefner). I also dug Letterman's band playing them on and off with "All Along the Watchtower".

[Arnie]

Here's a Battlestar Galactica video I made:

<object classid="clsid:d27cdb6e-ae6d-11cf-96b8-444553540000" height="388" width="464">


<embed flashvars="key=0b6c403c33" allowfullscreen="true" quality="high" src="http://www2.funnyordie.com/public/flash/fodplayer.swf?6045" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" height="388" width="464"></object><noscript>Battlestar Breakup (http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/0b6c403c33) on FunnyOrDie.com (http://www.funnyordie.com/)</noscript>

[Telfer]

I enjoyed that, Arnie.

[Chip]

Season 4 starts tonight, people. Get up on.

-Chip

[hixx]

We have a special date night planned tonight.

Battlestar Galactica date night.

I don't know what that means, but we're still having it.

Maybe we're going for Starbucks and Tai food.

Hixx

[Chip]

Maybe we're going for Starbucks and Tai food.

Took me a second, but I got it. You should pick up a six-pack while you're out.

-Chip

[sammy]

We have a special date night planned tonight.

Battlestar Galactica date night.

I don't know what that means, but we're still having it.

Maybe we're going for Starbucks and Tai food.

Hixx

Maybe you'll just get a Six pack.

[sammy]

dammit. chip's didn't show before.

why CIN why?

damn you stupid robot message board.

[Chip]

Oh Sammy, always a step behind...

[Hendo]

Of course he's a step behind. He's way too busy DRIVING RAY MEES AWAY FROM IMPROV!!

[sammy]

The F/X on this show are amazing. What a rockin' battle to start out the season. And, man, the Fall and Redemption of Gaius Baltar is sure fun to watch play out.

I have high hopes for this season.

[robbersean]

The first episode was pretty much everything I wanted it to be. The first 10 minutes were tense, and exciting, as were the last five. The middle featured alot of character exploration. We got some questions answered, and a whole bunch more to ask.

It really does look like th effects have taken dramatic leaps forward since last season- the ships during the first battle looked completely amazing.

Some favorite moments- Saul imagining himself shooting Adama in the face, Baltar trying to something good by helping the sick kid, Anders getting scanned by the Raider, Starbuck saying that she would shoot Anders in the face if she found out that he was a Cylon, Adama trying to give Lee his position back in the military.

I'm wicked excited for next week's episode. It looks like we might see some sort of a Cylon Civil War.

[Forsythe]

It looks like we might see some sort of a Cylon Civil War.

Yeah, this seems pretty freakin' awesome. But I bet it won't be until episode 9 that we see it. The concept of lobotomizing the raiders is super interesting.

Questions I look forward to getting answers to:
How come Anders didn't realize he "answered back" to the raider?
Are there other copies of the Final 5? (my guess is there aren't; hence the term "final" 5.)
On what terms are the Final 5 with the rest of the Cylons?
Was the Maelstorm a wormhole?
The actress that played the woman who rescues Baltar in the bathroom, what is up with her character? Because her demeanor is so weird. Or is she just a bad actress?

[Chip]

OK, so Colonel Tigh is a cylon. How is that possible? Bill knew him in from the military from before the first Cylon war, you know, back when they were all toasters.

So either the flesh-Cylons predate the metal ones (huh?) or they went back in time (weak) or something else I don't get. Wha happun?

[Forsythe]

OK, so Colonel Tigh is a cylon. How is that possible? Bill knew him in from the military from before the first Cylon war, you know, back when they were all toasters.

This is incorrect. Bill and Saul met after the first Cylon war. Though the show doesn't specify exactly how long after the end of the war did they meet.

Even if it was only a few years after the war, the cylons went from toasters to skin jobs pretty darn fast.

Add this to the list of questions I look forward to hearing an answer to during the course of season 4.

[Hendo]

Megan pointed out at the opening how low the number of survivors has dropped (they update it consitently).

I think the Cylon civil war (reportedly also the male vs. female Cylons) is coming really, really soon. I think it starts to break bad next episode.

ETA- it's also spooky that Starbuck's ship is brand-new again...

[Chip]

Ah, so it was after the first Cylon war. Again, like you said, that'd be a pretty fast transition. Makes me want to know the whole story, definitely.

[IreneM]

Tigh said that he had 40 years of military service, it was 40 years since the cylons disappeared. I get the feeling the final 5 are 'ancient' in a way that they haven't talked about yet. I don't know if the cylons created their human models from DNA from the original 12 tribes of Kobol or what, but I think they are tied to that history. Weren't Chief's parents priests? Have we heard the background of any of the other newly revealed Cylons?

I'm also excited to see which cylon is going to make the switch from believing in one god to believing in many.

[sammy]

One of the main themes is "cycles" repeating themselves. I wouldn't be surprised if the Final Five are cylons (or cylon-human hybrids) who transcended the need to Download into a carbon copy body via mechanical means--basically the Final Five have consciousnesses that can jump from their body into a new body upon their death. I wouldn't be surprised if the Final Five are from a previous cycle of history.

[IreneM]

I don't think that the final five are cylon/human hybrids. If that were the case, why would Boomer (that's what I will call her forever) and Chief's respective children be special at all? What is the 'shape of things to come'? I think it's racial blending which will make it impossible to tell the difference between cylons and humans.

Question ... if you were starving could you eat a cylon raider?

[Mr. Keith]

Something that's been bugging me since the beginning (well, since when I started watching) and I'm wondering if they've explained it: How do the Cylons not know who the "final five" are if they all were made only 40 years ago (approximately)? You'd think all 12 would've posed for a group photo at some point or something.

I have noticed how all the recently revealed Cylons all seem to be assistants to the main characters in some way. My thinking is that Adama, Rosilyn, Starbuck, Gaius, and probably someone else are all really gods, and the Cylons are supposed to help them.

Or not. But, it's fun guessing.

And, yeah, I loved Ty's imagining that he shot Adama in the head. I knew it didn't really happen because it honestly felt like too much was getting piled on, even for this show. But, of all shows where I would've believed it...

It reminded me of the finale of season 2, when Baltar gets elected president and the show jumped a year. I kept thinking, "Ok, so when is everyone going to wake up and it's a dream. There's no way a TV show's going to diverge from their setting this much." And then, they did. And I loved it.

[Sleeps]

Question ... if you were starving could you eat a cylon raider?

Sure. It's all protein in there. Probably tastes like blood pudding or giblets.

Grind it all up, make a type of meat loaf out of it, and serve it with a fried egg on top. MmmmHmmmm.

[JRC]

I love the series. I think the "Dirty Work" episode is one of the finest works ever to grace TV.

I didn't/don't like the premiere episode.
It reminds me of the movie "Contact."

[schaefe]

Something that's been bugging me since the beginning (well, since when I started watching) and I'm wondering if they've explained it: How do the Cylons not know who the "final five" are if they all were made only 40 years ago (approximately)? You'd think all 12 would've posed for a group photo at some point or something.

Well, what has been brought up several times is that the other 6 Cylon models have been programmed (or directed) purposely not to think, or remember anything about them.

However, Roslin does point out to Caprica Six in the brig that is not necessarily true, as the Six is clearly thinking about them as Roslin is asking her questions about them. However, the first six may not be able to consciously think about them very much for long periods due to their programming.

When D'Anna (Number Three? I forget her model number) "unmasks" one of the final five in the Temple of Five on the Algae planet she was clearly surprised to find out that the one she saw was Tigh (or at least we think it was Tigh, as she apologizes).

The real question is whether the final five were created first, or last in the series, or have existed all along...spooky....

Anyway, remember the words of the Hybrid in "Razor". Very prophetic for Season Four.

[Mr. Keith]

Anyway, remember the words of the Hybrid in "Razor". Very prophetic for Season Four.

Sad to say, I can't remember what was said. But I do now remember that it was significant (oh, it was that one Cylon in the tanks, right? It's all coming back to me). Time to look up the episode. I didn't realize the gap of time made me forget so much.

I also loved, in this past series premiere, Starbuck taking a gun to the President. I remember not being all that surprised, as if it was just a normal day on the ship. That's not to say it wasn't great (anyone walking through a door full of smoke looks cool). But it just shows how good the show is when something like that happens and it's par for the course ("What? Only one character has a gun pulled on them? This should be nothing.")

[Mr. Keith]

After he just looked it up on Wikipedia:

Oh, that's right. Starbuck's going to bring about the apocalypse and screw us all. Well, I'd say pulling a gun on the President's a good start. Let's see what happens tomorrow (or, in my case, Saturday, when it's on Hulu.com).

[sammy]

I think the Hybrid's prophecy was more metaphorical than literal--it's the end of the human race....as we know it.

And, for fun, the ramblings of the hybrid...

At last they’ve come for me. I feel their lives, their destinies spilling out before me. The denial of the one true path, played out on a world not their own, will end soon enough.

Soon there will be four, glorious in awakening. Struggling with the knowledge of their true selves. The pain of revelation bringing new clarity. And in the midst of confusion, he will find her, enemies brought together by impossible longing, enemies now joined as one. The way forward, at once unthinkable, yet inevitable. And the fifth still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering. I can see them all. The seven now six self-described machines, machines who believe themselves without sin. But in time, it is sin that will consume them. They will know enmity, bitterness, the wrenching agony of the one splintering into the many and then they will join the promised land, gathered on the wings of an Angel. Not an end, but a beginning.

...

Kara Thrace will lead the human race to its end. She is the herald of the apocalypse, the harbinger of death. They must not follow her. As my own existence comes to a close only to begin anew in ways uncertain. All this has happened before and will happen again. Again, again. Again. Again...

[sammy]

Just caught the sci fi stream of tonight's ep. Some great scenes, including one that will make you go WTF?!? and laugh out loud.

[Mr. Keith]

Just caught the sci fi stream of tonight's ep. Some great scenes, including one that will make you go WTF?!? and laugh out loud.

I can't think of which one that was. Well, I can't think of which one that was specifically, as that occurred to me a number of times. But, then, I watch the show on my laptop and sometimes have to put my face closer to the speakers than I like when people start mumbling.

Damn you, method actors. Go think about your dead goldfish while the rest of us practice our annunciation.

Speaking of which, did we see Adama putting back together that model ship he destroyed, the one that was apparently a museum piece in real life? Do you think everyone stood around the set, on edge, afraid Edward James Olmos was going suddenly just smash it up again? Maybe model ships just send him into a rage. I picture Olmos sitting on the set, late into the night, while the owner watches him with his arms folded, saying, "We're not leaving here until you've glued every little piece of my model ship back the was it was, Mr. Blade Runner."

[robbersean]

Did anyone else's jaw drop when Baltar was talking to Baltar? It was funny, but it was definitely one of those BSG "What in the hell is going on here" moments.

I'm really looking forward to seeing Captain Starbuck and her motley crew on the sewage processing ship. I thought that Adama giving her that ship was an awesome moment.

[Chip]

I'm very curious where they're going with the Cylon schism. If we are to believe humans created the Cylons (something about which I'm vaguely sure we're not hearing the whole story), then it's a hypocritical thing for the Kavel models to deny the Centurions and Raiders their autonomy. That's exactly why the Cylons rebelled against the humans.

So the Sixes and her supporters are the ones who are at least morally consistent. Is it strange that I'm looking at the Sixes as a kind of protagonist?

Also, Baltar talking to himself? What's that mean?!? (right, like we knew what Baltar talking to Six meant.)

-Chip

P.S. I don't know what scene Sammy's talking about either. Enlighten us, Sammy.

[IreneM]

The cylon developments were so great. Holy MOLY!!!! That new six stole my heart.

[sammy]

Did anyone else's jaw drop when Baltar was talking to Baltar? It was funny, but it was definitely one of those BSG "What in the hell is going on here" moments.

Chip. duh. that's the scene.

your face.

[Chip]

Ah, ok. I was more puzzled/amused than laughing. But yeah, that was some shit.

See, I am with Irene on this. Six liberating the centurions to save the raiders is pretty cool. But on the other hand, I could absolutely seeing them turn that on its ear as she goes on to liberate all the cylons from the
humans. So they make her sympathetic enough to get behind her, then turn her into the big bad in the end.

Or not. I have no idea where this is going, and I love that.

Looking forward to Battlestar Turdbucket, though. :)

-Chip

[Chip]

I have a question regarding the term "final five". Now, we, as watchers, have been calling them the final five because they were the last to be revealed to us.

But the Cylons call them the final five as well. What the hell does that mean to the Cylons? The final five what? They're not hte final five model numbers, because that would be 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. And we already know who the 8's are (Sharon, I believe).

So were they the final five to be created? That would be odd, too, because they'd have to be inserted into human society pretty early following the first Cylon war. How long as Adama known Tigh? Did we establish that?

So yeah, why do the other 7 call them the final five?

And of course, why are they "forbidden" to think/talk about them? And who/what forbids them?

-Chip

Edited to add:

Baltar could be the last Cylon. First of all, the talking to himself thing, and that scene when he's in Six's head from a while ago. But then there was this scene on Friday's episode, where he's having sex with Tory, and they focus on his back/spine for a long time. It reminded me of the scene in the miniseries when Six's spine glows red when they're ahving sex. Now his spine didn't glow red, but he and Tory stopped short of orgasm, as well. Anyway, I think that was a subtle clue they stuck in there.

Edited again to add:

Oh oh oh, one more thing. Simple way to test if Starbuck is really "feeling" the jumps. Go one jump back towards the nebula and see if she says they're going the right direction. Just don't tell her you're jumping that way. But story-wise, I like how they used that to show Adama trusting Starbuck again. That was a great scene. :)

[robbersean]

There was a point on the episode where Cavil mentioned "the programmers" and I found myself wondering just who the programmers were.

Also, here to my knowledge, are the Cylons by number:

1- Cavil
2- Leobehn
3- D'Anna
4- Simon
5- Doral
6- Caprica
7-?
8- Sharon
9-?
10-?
11-?
12-?

One thing to note, Sharon, Tigh, Anders, Tory, and Tyrol were all active, important members of the military, or government of the fleet. We know Sharon is 8, and we assume that the others must be 7, 9, 10, 11, or 12.

[Forsythe]

Tigh and Adama met sometime after the First Cylon War. The show doesn't specify how long after the armistice did it take for them to meet.

Again, I'll offer my theory to the "Final Five" problem. I think the Final Five were the first to split off from the Cylons due to their pro-human sympathies. I think the vote came down 7 to 5 in favor of killing the humans and the Final Five couldn't handle it. I have a feeling model 8 (Boomer, Athena) betrayed the Final Five by voting the other way. I think the Final Five destroyed all their copies; or the other Cylons tried to cold storage them and only one copy of each model got away. In this sense, I believe each of the Final Five is the only remaining (hint: "final") copy of their model. I think the raiders and/or the Centurians were on the side of the Final Five and that's why they've been made essentially into puppets of the skins jobs. I think the other seven models decided to erase from their memories a history in which Cylons weren't a cohesive unit. But if you forget your past you're doomed to repeat it, which we're seeing right now with the Cylon Civil War (it's not a war yet, I'm just guessing it might escalate to that). I think the Final Five decided to hide themselves within the Colonies and rise up in the ranks with the hope of protecting the humans.


My theory has a LOT of assumptions.

[IreneM]

FORSYTHE .... amazing. I LOVE it.

[Telfer]

I like Forsythe's theory.

In response to Chip not getting Cavil: whatever the purpose of the final five is, it is desperately important to the programmers and Cylon culture that they remain secret. This season's two episodes have worked to make that clear. A raider questioning that is so tantamount to treason that I think it makes sense that the more conservative models be up in arms.

Here's a good interview (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07085/770732-352.stm) with Ron Moore that, I think, leaves a lot of hints as to where this is going. Potential spoiler: he says the Final Five are "fundamentally different" from the other Cylons.

[Forsythe]

I would love it if the programmer of the skin jobs was the Baltar from the original Galactica series. [I haven't seen the original series so I have no idea is the first Baltar even lives]

I would love it if the final cylon model was Billy, Roslin's first assistant.

[Chip]

Oh, I "get" him. He's being irrational just like anyone could be. I get why he's up in arms.

My point is that I would have thought Six would call him on it more directly, point out his hypocrisy. Then again, she allows the centurions to shoot him, which is pretty direct.


-Chip

[Chip]

I would love it if the final cylon model was Billy, Roslin's first assistant.

The actor who played Billy asked to leave the show. Supposedly he was going to be one of the final five. So after they killed him off, they created Tory and made her one of the final five.

-Chip

[JRC]

The OB (Original Baltar) was played by John Colicos.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0171475/

He passed away in 2000.

That was a wonderfully poorly made series. It's hilarious.

[JRC]

What If....

at the series end, the entire armada is being wiped out by the Hidden Ones, a heretofore secret race of SuperCylons!! Roslyn and Adama are on the bridge, they (finally!) kiss and they press the button that will activates the reciprocal link destruct sequence (linking the warpjump to all the nuclear warheads... basically a giant rip/explosion in the Space/Time fabric)... a blinding flash fills the screen... as...


Dirk Benedict wakes up in a cold sweat. He turns to Athena and tells her about the strange dream he just had. She replies, "Go back to frakkin' sleep, Starbuck."

[John P. Glynn]

At which point we pull back to reveal the Galactica floating in a snowglobe and learn the entire series took place in the imagination of an Autistic child. Then "Don't Stop Believin" plays over the end credits.

Or, seriously ... what if the last Cylon is us? Think about it.

[schaefe]

Oh wow....oh....man!

Glynn, you have really snarfled my garflong now...I gotta rethink the whole series!

[John P. Glynn]

Hey Sammy when will the new episodes' Podcast commentary be available?

I'll hang up for the answer.

[sammy]

good question, jpg. i was wondering the same thing.

addendum:

for those with liberal work policies on streaming video...


THIS FRIDAY ONLY: You'll have eight chances to see this week's episode early. Starting at 9 a.m. (Eastern Time), we'll show live streams of "Ties That Bind" at the top of the hour, every hour. The last showing will start at 4 p.m. (Eastern Time).

[John P. Glynn]

No pressure Samson, but I bet six people you would know the answer to this question. Can't you make like a Cilon and check in with the Oracle or whatever?

I really need this info.

[robbersean]

Oh, poor Callie.

[Chip]

Wow, dark frakking episode, that one.

Also, anyone else notice the three of them met in Weapons Locker 1701D? :)


-Chip

[IreneM]

Yeah! I think Ronnie Moore (that's what I call him) used to write for TNG.

[John P. Glynn]

One thing about that show ... bait and switch? Totally minimal.

As soon as Callie strolled into the airlock, you knew someone was about to make a dramatic exit. Even when it seemed like everyone was making nice, I felt comfortable as a viewer knowing the writers don't pull that manipulative bullshit.

And yes, I was pretty pleased with myself for catching the 1701D reference.

[Telfer]

I'm glad they're having Tory submit to the Cylon genocidal tendencies. Her character was really freaking pointless otherwise. I know she came in late to the series to replace that kid who got killed off, but she just had too few emotional ties to other humans for me to care she was a Cylon.

Now she's sending people out the airlock, which is interesting.

I thought for sure Callie would turn out to be a Cylon when she said she'd been feeling sick since they were in the nebula. Maybe she will still turn out to have been one?

[Steev]

What's a Cylon?

[hixx]

1701D? I'm lame, what's the reference?

What I think is interesting too is that the only way these guys know they're cylons is they've heard the song and talked to each other about it.

I think whatshername pushed lady out the airlock because she "thinks" she's a cylon, not because she knows she's one. Like someone told her she is one so now she's doing all this bad stuff and I think it would be awesome if it turned out she wasn't one.

Power of suggestion.

Hixx

[Telfer]

Ron Moore has said in interviews that these 4 are actually Cylons, and that it's not some kind of ruse.

She backhanded Callie ten feet across the airlock, I think it helps if you just accept she is a Cylon! Humans can't do that, and there's not going to be a plot where she realizes she's just a human with one of those wacky 12 Monkeys fillings that picks up radio signals.

Google 1701D if you want to know the answer!@#

[John P. Glynn]

Hicks, 1701D was the Hilton hotel room number where Jeremy Bulloch stayed during the first comicon in San Diego. It's an obscure reference, but well-known among scifi geeks.

[hixx]

Telfer, you ever seen me backhand someone? I can make you fly like you're Superman on steroids brother....

And I post here so I don't have to google, google doesn't have the same hilarious yet insightful perspective that you guys have....or that Glynn has.

Thanks Glynn.

Hixx

[John P. Glynn]

Another thing: "frak" is a fine substitute for the F-word as a one-off expletive of frustration. And while silly, it even sorta works in well-known F-centric expressions like "go frak yourself" and "motherfrakker".

But when specifically referring to the physical act of love? As it was in the scene with Starbuck and Sam? Ree-diculous.

[Socrates]

hixx, 1701D is the serial number for the enterprise in STNG for the show until the destruction of it in Generations

also telfer we know that they are cylons because of the eye scan/ call off of attack when the raider scans sam, and his eye "reacts" with a red light up....if you have tivo...it is not just a reflection of the raiders eye (i had to rewind to see it) hit is like an iris opening red (like activating) and when the raider rides off, he comes out of the trance.

also telfer i hope you and your flashforward hating friends (i mean you chip :) ) have seen the error of your ways...it was the best and most impressive device to use becuase moore has admitted that he only wanted the show to go 4 or 5 seasons (4 was the final call as we know) so it was not lazy, but a way to tell a concise story that has depth and purpose. all the the flash forwards and flash backs...played out and still is playing out. think about the how awesome this sal and cheif as cylons has played out because of new caprica... and the next time showing sal's wife...the women he killed for colaborating...

the reason i love on this show so much is that i feel that very little of the show is unintentional. and when it is...it is interesting and fun.

so there i am done...

[Telfer]

Anthony, while I enjoy the attention, I think you're confusing me with someone else on the eye scan thing. I agree and haven't said otherwise. Also, I'm over the flash-forward stuff, the show made up for it very quickly.

[JRC]

I liked and hated the eyescan thingie.

I thought it was a great development for both the Gang of Four, and the Raider's burgeoning sentience.

BUT, it is the only evidence that the Gang of Four are cyclons and I kinda liked not knowing... they're really (before the Raider recognization) just going on their own hunches. It'd be funny if that song thing was really just Val Kilmer sending them songs through their braces.

[John P. Glynn]

... was really just Val Kilmer sending them songs through their braces.
Hicks, this a reference to ST: The Next Generation episode #147 entitled "House Full of Popcorn".

[hixx]

Thanks Glynn, but I totally already knew that reference. Val is such a chameleon.

And I am SO down with you on the "FRAK ME NOW BIG BOY" thing, didna work.

And yeah, that was me that didn't see that there was proof they were cylons. But JRC get my point there...sorta. And the eyescan meant we knew Anders was one, not Tory necessarily, but yeah, okay, she's really strong.

What about the 6's? We still aren't sure they're totally gone though right?

Hixx

[Chip]

Anthony, you may have me confused as well, with one of the flash-forward haters. Or maybe I was and don't remember. I think it was a good choice, though. I didn't really like the episodes on New Caprica, so flashing forward to get to the important bits is fine with me.

What I do not like are the little teaser shots of they show they display during the introduction, that give away stuff that will happen during the upcoming episode. I have to turn my head and listen to know when that's over, or fast-forward on my DVR (and not watch during the fast-forward).

Hixx, as for the 6's and the Sharons (forget their number, 8 maybe?) I don't think we know if they're all dead. There's so much to about Cylon society that we don't know, that the destruction of some base ships might signify killing all of them or just some of them. I'm guessing we'll find out more soon.

What a dark frakking episode, though. Callie's sad last few days alive, thinking her husband is cheating on her, only to find out he's a Cylon instead, deciding to kill herself and her halfbreed child, being talked down, only to find out the other Cylon wanted the baby alive but you dead, topped off with explosive decompression murder. So much for the cute, plucky tech.

-Chip

[Jels]

Great episode! Yeah, poor Callie, but I loved the Cylon sneak attack on the Six and Eights. It was brutal that Six had One killed, but the Resurrection ship was nearby. This time it didn't make the jump. Awesome!

Wasn't Tory also taking care of Boomer and Helo's child when they were on New Caprica? Nice circle back to Tory now taking care of Callie's kid.

And what's up with Starbuck? She has heck of a crew: Helo, Gaeta, Sharon...how long before mutiny? Can't she just retrace the jumps Galactica made and work from there?

[Telfer]

Jels- maybe Starbuck already did that and now she's fucking around.

So... which 6s and 8s are dead forever now? All but one each? Which 6 is still alive, I forget? That's a lot of dead characters, when you think about it. There were unique plots for at least three of each.

[Forsythe]

Jels, you are mistaken about who took care of Helo and Athena's baby. It was some other lady, not Tory. That woman was killed during the exodus of New Caprica. Her body was laying next to the child when D'Anna found the baby. The two actress are similar, however, in that they're both women with sort-of longish brown hair.

[sammy]

Freaky visions abound.
The semi-final four cope.
Baltar continues his ascent to religious leadership.
Lee Adama continues his ascent to political leadership.
I love this show.

[robbersean]

I think I've found the character development of the four the most fascinating part of this season so far. Watching Tyrol's speech in the mess was so crazy, and effed up. Tory has gone from being a background character to an evil sex-crazed murderer. Tigh seems to have no idea what's up or down anymore.

Also, is Baltar finally starting to do things for other people, shedding his selfish persona? I had a crazy thought over the weekend- what if Roslyn is NOT the dying leader? What if it's Baltar? What if Baltar somehow starts dying before the end of the show and through his religious movement, ends up leading the fleet to the land of milk and honey (Earth)?

[John P. Glynn]

Hey Sammy when will the new episodes' Podcast commentary be available?
Commentary for episodes 4 and 5 are up.

[John P. Glynn]

Thanks!!

&nbsp;

[IreneM]

Cheif's speech to Adama was so scary and great! And TRUE! Callie was annoying and I for one am not sorry to see her go. I was a little disappointed that they had her on pills in her last episode - she was crazy and obnoxious enough without a scapegoat. And she was right, any woman who would become romantically involved with a man who punches her in the face needs to get her head examined.

The Baltar stuff was great too. Did anyone else's stomach drop when Six gave his name to Tigh?

Maybe the dying leader is Starbuck?

[John P. Glynn]

I love the Private Pyle look on Chief Tyrol. I could watch Tory saunter arouund Galactica all day long. I am sick of Starbuck. I would almost be sick of the religious stuff but I'm hopeful that they're banking the sfx budget for an epic two-episode battle with the Cylons in the second half of the season. I predict Rosslyn will be saved by blood from Tyrol and Callie's baby.

I am enjoying this season. More Tom Zarek please.

[sammy]

My new theory on the Fifth Cylon? I'm guessing Doc Cottle. It'd be perfect. The crotchety doctor who caretakess humanity in his gruff way.

[John P. Glynn]

So that really was Barbara Bush playing the President's mother on the shore?

This was my favorite episode since they left New Caprica.

[robbersean]

It certainly looked like Barbara Bush, didn't it? There was also one guy who looked vaguely like Colin Powell in a colonial uniform, but he was REALLY blurry.

I thought the imagery of the destroyed cylon fleet was really striking- the Raiders floating through space, the giant tracts of Basestar flesh strung out all over the place, the sparks, the explosions- it was all very bleak, but almost beautiful.

Oh, and it was nice to see Major Kira show up.

[Chip]

Yeah, loved the Basestar graveyard shots. I wanted more of them, but I imagine they cut down to keep the budget down. I thought the reveal of the basestar-as-comet was cool, but I think I'd have liked to see more significant shots of Kara's painting so that we as audience had a shot of recognizing shat she was seeing before Starbuck calls it out. Still, very cool!

I loved where this takes the show. With their interpretation of the hybrid's prophecy, there's a very clear path of what has to be accomplished, and I can already see some interesting antagonistic roadblocks.

I loved Gaeta's reaction to getting shot. From an acting standpoint, that's the most realistic reaction to getting shot that I've seen in film in a long time. He really seemed like he was in tremendous pain.

Sam was interesting during this episode. I liked the shots of him wondering what would happen if he stuck his hands in the water interface.

Also, can't wait to see them unbox Deanna to find out who the final Cylon is. Also, since the final five are needed to find the path to Earth, it probably means that they're going to have to reveal themselves to the humans, and that's not going to go well.

Plus, all this stuff about Roslyn and the river, and Baltar talking about the river. How's that going to play out?

So much good stuff in this episode. Awesome!

-Chip

[IreneM]

I thought it was great!!!!!

I thought Gaeta getting shot was the funniest thing since Chief's wife got punched by the MIA cylon.

[finger]

My guess--Zarek

[sammy]

Just caught the opening teaser for tonight's BSG on scifi. Man, great opener. Can't wait for tonight's episode!

[IreneM]

HOLY MACARONI!!!! That was amazing!!!

[Telfer]

Athena was kind of a pussy.

I knew JUMP was going to happen! What could they possibly have expected!?

A lot happened this episode, which I liked, but I was a little bummed at how stupid those two character choices were.

[sammy]

I was absolutely stunned by the abrupt turn in tone.

http://stylemens.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/02/28/galactica.jpg

[robbersean]

Wow, alot of stuff happened in this one.

So let's see:

Roslin knows that Tory is bonking Baltar.
Baltar is trying to make the people of the fleet turn on Roslin.
The Rebel Cylons want to be able to die, and they want the final five, and they want to unbox D'Anna, and they want to find Earth.
Tigh almost showed his hand by calling off the attack on the BaseStar.
Lee seems like he may end up in conflict at some point with Roslin.
Zarek is still causing problems.
The Cylons are planning on betraying the Humans, though they're going to try to call it off.
The Humans are planning on betraying the Cylons.
Athena goes batshit and takes out Natalie.
Hera is drawing Six with crayons.
Bill Adama is still awesome.
Baltar, Roslin, and Starbuck awaken the Hybrid who takes them to ?


So much awesome, and now we have to wait two weeks for the next one?

[Telfer]

AND two weeks for Lost. WTF?

[Chip]

Yeah, Athena shooting Six annoyed me. Is she really that out of it? Plus, she wasn't the Six in the dream. It's the Six in the brig, right? didn't Roslyn and Athena already talk to the Six in the brig a while ago the last time the dreams happened? I know Roslyn did, but I don't know if Athena was there.

At least the Cylons can't get mad at the humans for that one, since it was Athena who did it.

-Chip

[Telfer]

Yeah, wrong Six. The Six in the brig is sharing the visions. Though they don't make it clear Hera is experiencing the visions or whether her drawing Six is related to something other than the Opera House vision.

How come Athena snapped? So many other characters are on the verge of flipping out, where the shit did that come from? Shouldn't Athena, of all people, know the difference between models?

AND the Six that ORIGINALLY went to the Opera House was Caprica Six, who just took one to the back of the head on the Basestar right?

[IreneM]

Yes, it's best if we all pretend this episode never happened. WORST OF THE SERIES.

[Telfer]

I can't believe they:

A) Brought back the lawyer character.
B) Made him the main plotline.
C) Gave him that incredibly written-by-a-Republican-or-retarded-Democrat dialogue where he threatened to kill Lee because Lee had hope.
D) Made him crazy because his kitty died.
E) Gave him a puppy.

Not making the final five part of the main plot thread is a crime at this point. There is so much they could have done with the Tigh/Six plot without revealing whatever they're planning to reveal there. And no Tyroll, my favorite character. Hell, no Roslin either.

I deem it this season's shitty one-off episode (http://www.rooftopcomedy.com/watch/Great_show_terrible_episode). Nothing happened except for a disposable character study. But that's no good, because this is the last season! Bleh. My point is I agree, Irene.

[Chip]

Yup, that was unnecessary. And Six is preggers?

-Chip

[Telfer]

Hard to say, since they dedicated all of 14 seconds to it.

You know, so they'd have time for the Kitty Lawyer.

[robbersean]

Y'know, I wasn't totally dissatisfied with this one. I thought the stuff with the Old Man was good. The scene where he and Tigh fought was awesome, and I loved the stuff with him and Athena too. I also love the image of him sitting out by himself in that raptor reading a book.

But is it possible for a single character to jump the shark? Because I think Romo Lampkin just did. I was with the episode and enjoying it until the scene with the gun and the dead cat. I hated that scene so much.

Also, how frustrating is it when they end the show on a cliffhanger (in this case the Basestar jumping away) and then don't let the cliffhanger pay off in the next episode?

[JRC]

I agree with the cliffhanger thing, Sean... unless...

The next episode is solely on the basestar without a glimpse of the Fleet. That would be a ballsy move.

Poor Adama's model ship.

You know what Galactica really needs? A Ships Counselor.

[Chip]

You know what Galactica really needs? A Ships Counselor.

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j101/microchip2222/cylon-troi.jpg

Yikes!

[IreneM]

I will also yikes her camel toe

[Chip]

Son of a bitch!

Tease!

-Chip

[Telfer]

I agree with the cliffhanger thing, Sean... unless...

The next episode is solely on the basestar without a glimpse of the Fleet. That would be a ballsy move.


Oh snap! Good call.

Decent episode. Great effects in the Resurrection Hub sequence

I could have done without the President's weirdass flashes during the jumps. I thought they were really lame. I was glad she finally got some resolution with the old man though.

[robbersean]

I thought this was a great one.

Some thoughts:


How weird was it to see a huge space battle with no Starbuck, and no Apollo?

I laughed outloud a few times during the scenes of Roslyn and Baltar trying to talk to the Hybrid.

I really liked the very brief scene of Helo seeing all of the model 8's in the hub.

I actually teared up a little at the end when Rosyln told the Old Man that she loved him and he replied "It's about time."

[MikeJ]

I thoroughly enjoyed this episode.

Maybe it was the mood I was in but I could not stop chuckling when Baltar was talking to the Toaster Cylon about God. Seeing the Cylon process this info was hilarious to me.

[sammy]

AICN review up (no spoilers) (http://www.aintitcool.com/node/37054)

All the pieces are in place for a rockin' season finale...truly looking forward to this!

[Telfer]

Well, it's also a series finale, so it better be fucking good.

[Arnie]

Uh... it's not the series finale. And technically it's not even really the season finale. The season is being broken in half. The other ten episodes air sometime next year.


Did I just fall into a trap?

watch Mystery Cove,
Arnie

[Telfer]

Oh, really? I didn't know. Seriously, that one totally got by me and now there is yet more proof I am an imbecile.

Hilarious.

http://www.quantummechanix.com/BSGPropagandaGallery_files/never_forget_gallery.jpg

[sammy]

Uh... it's not the series finale. And technically it's not even really the season finale. The season is being broken in half. The other ten episodes air sometime next year.


eh. it's like 2.5. it's a "mini-season"

but what do you expect from a stinkin' cylon lover like niekamp? nothing but half-lies and obfuscation to confuse us and keep us from ferreting his skin-job lovin' ass out.

[Telfer]

Arnie might fuck clone robots or whatever, but there is a whole lot of publicly indexable proof that I am an imbecile.

[elisabeth]

i have yet to watch battlestar galactica, but my favorite band made a video with some lady from the show, so this seems like an appropriate place to post it. it's not a great video, but it's cute enough, and look, some hot lady from the BSG! and a frack t-shirt! neat!

<object height="344" width="425">
<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/DDDyD0Hj5n0&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" height="344" width="425"></object>

[sammy]

Just watched the finale on scifi.com.

We have to wait until 2009?

NOOOOOOOOOO!

[Chip]

Woah, I just tried to watch, and it started me in the middle of the episode. Does it air on an hourly schedule or something?

-Chip

[Biddle]

Yeah, it hours every hour on the hour until 4pm today.

Word.

COB out...

[Chip]

This is the background image on the website today:

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j101/microchip2222/lastsupperBSG.jpg

Last Supper, hah! :)

-Chip

[John P. Glynn]

They used that to advertise the new season too. Is the mid-season finale tonight or next Friday?

And Nahnsen, did you read this because I wrote it even though you don't watch BSG?

[Chip]

Is the mid-season finale tonight or next Friday?

It's tonight.

[Telfer]

So much for "all will be revealed". I thought the last of the 5 was in the finale. Lame ending.

[Chip]

I felt a little let down, too, honestly. What's on Earth? What's on Earth? ...oh, it's a post-apocalyptic wasteland. OK.

For such dramatic stuff happening - the reveal of the final four to the fleet, the viper pointing the direction to Earth, the jump to Earth - I somehow didn't feel the suspense like I was hoping for.

I think maybe it was because last week's trailer showed Starbuck stopping the three from being airlocked. So I didn't feel any suspense that they would be killed.

And then, on Earth, the gray sky, and the disappointment/confusion on their faces did make me wonder what they were looking at, but it was just generic ruins of a long-gone civilization. I guess I was hoping for something more shocking, like the Eiffel Tower fallen on its side.

I did like the scene of Adama being held by Lee and crying. Made me a little misty-eyed, watching him weep, making me think what it would be like to find that out about a friend of 30 years. That was well done.

And Lee punching Tigh. That was a pretty genuine moment.

Also, note that D'anna asked the fleet to produce, specifically the "four" cylons that were among them. She knows who the fifth is, but somehow she knows the fifth isn't among them. Is that because she knows the fifth is already on the basestar, someone like Baltar or Roslyn? Why would she not want the fifth if he/she was in the fleet already? And what role will the final cylon play? I guess it depends on where they go from here, what they discover on Earth, what happens with the Opera House prophecy and Hera.

So, on to speculation...a couple thoughts. First, Earth is an apocalyptic wasteland. What happened to it? Wouldn't it be something if Earth was a Cylon world, and the thirteenth tribe, humans, came and nuked it, the same way the Cylons nuked the colonies? That would be a strange sort of karmic balance.

Or, what if they're on the wrong planet? Follow me here. The final four cylons feel the pull to go visit Starbuck's viper. Now, when they see the viper, they get Starbuck to examine it again, and she finds the compass pointer thingy, which shows the way to Earth. Presumably Starbuck or the techs had checked that out before, and that compass thingy didn't point anywhere. But something changed. What if that change was having the final four in proximity of the viper. That proximity activated the compass. But, there were only three of the four there. Tory was on the basestar at the time. Maybe it takes all of them to be in proximity to activate the viper's compass properly. Maybe it takes all five. So without all of them, it points to another planet.

I realize that's a stretch. And Starbuck didn't get the heebie jeebies and freak out that they're going the wrong way, like she was before. But it could be.

Frakking 2009?

[Telfer]

Where'd you see 2009? All I see says "Coming Soon" or refers to this as the "summer finale", implying it's sooner than 2009. Maybe not. I dunno, can you link that or something Chip/Sammy?

That Tory character seems to find a way to be more and more irrelevant and uncompelling every episode. They can go ahead and kill her early next mini-season.

Chip- they make a point of saying the constellations match the prophecy of Earth's location. And while this show has a lot of red herrings and twists, it would be a little unusual for them to re-use the viper as a major plot point and undo all the build up to this planet. There's not that many episodes left of the show. They don't gain anything by sucking the dramatic tension they spent on this episode. I'm pretty sure this is Earth. It was just the biggest bummer note they could have ended on, and your body is rejecting it.

[Chip]

I'm going on what Sammy said, for 2009. I have no idea.

And yeah, I forgot about the constellation thing. So you can probably ignore all that viper speculation.

Still annoyed by the episode. Compare that to the revelation of the four at last season's finale. I don't mind that there was nothing there on Earth, but I am annoyed that there was nothing there and it's going to be a while before we get anything new.

[Telfer]

Specifically the "all will be revealed" bit they used to publicize this episode was annoying.

Clearly the last Cylon was the most interesting thing left to reveal. I get that they long since planned on holding that part of the plot back a little longer when literally editing and producing the show, but then those commercials were real bullshit advertising.

[sammy]

Chicago Trib (http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2008/06/battlestars-fin.html)

[robbersean]

I really kind of loved this one. The scene of Adama flipping out? Loved it. But then, I think I just love watching Bill flip his shit in general.

The standoff between D'Anna and Lee? Also cool.

And the end? Wow, right? What do you make of it? Where does the show go from here? What does it mean? I mean, there are ten episodes left, and they found Earth, but it's a wasteland. So, what happens now?

We still need to find out who the fifth is, and what their deal is (and does D'Anna know who the fifth is or not?). We need to find out what the deal is with Starbuck and her haunted Viper, we need to find out how everything has happened before, and will happen again, what the deal with the final four is, what's up with Hera, and what's up with the crazy Opera house dreams.

So many questions, and now we have months to discuss them all.

[MikeJ]

I liked the ending. In my head, I read it as the 13th colony wiped itself out. (What was the building that Lee and Kara referenced from the book that they
later discovered destroyed? It wasn't the opera house was it?)

It was great that the elation everyone experienced on finding earth was flipped to show their utter disappointment at what they did find.

Also, according to SyFy Portal:
As fans start to worry about how long they'll have to wait to see how Friday's cliffhanger concludes, Chicago Tribune columnist Maureen Ryan has some good news: we may be getting a bigger dose of "Battlestar Galactica" in 2009 in the form of at least one telemovie similar to "Razor" and two additional hours tacked on to the end.

Moore told Ryan that the last episode is three hours long, and it's likely SciFi Channel will opt to not air the entire episode in one night, and instead, break it down into three more episodes.

The expansion of the last half of the season would follow a telemovie that could begin as early as the completion of production on the "Battlestar" spinoff "Caprica," according to some sources with SyFy Portal. "Caprica" is already in pre-production, if not in full-blown production, and there are no strike orders for some of the main sets for "Battlestar Galactica" at its Vancouver, B.C., studio.

Because Glen A. Larson holds the movie rights for "Battlestar Galactica" and not NBC Universal, a telemovie would likely air on SciFi Channel and then have an "instant" DVD release, likely within a week of the broadcast.

Ryan had previously reported that as many as three "Battlestar" movies were being considered, but it's unclear if the other two would be made.

Although official distribution numbers were never released, sources have said in the past that sales met the goals set by the SciFi Channel high brass.

[John P. Glynn]

The outing of the secret four Cylons and the arrival on Earth seemed rushed to the point of almost being anticlimactic. Still, I've enjoyed these last few episodes considerably more than the Baltarism religious overtones of the early episodes. And with the "Will they or won't they find Earth?" mystery resolved, I'm eager to see what they'll do with the final 10 (12?) episodes.

My only beefs with the recent installments are:

- The notion that the Zarek would so quickly step aside and let (hell, encourage) Lee assume the Presidency. They wrote this guy to love conflict as much as he loves leadership ... why does he go so gently here?

- The total waste of Rolo Lampkin a few weeks ago. He was so great during Baltar's trial, so I can't buy that he became that unhinged since then.

Other than that, I love having Three back and have been basking in the Sci-Fi HD glow of the last few weeks' battle scenes.

We still need to find out who the fifth is, and what their deal is (and does D'Anna know who the fifth is or not?).
I think she does because she was pretty quick to point out the fifth was not in the fleet.

But does that mean they're just not a member of the military or that it's someone from the human race whose been floating around out there for three years?

[IreneM]

But does that mean they're just not a member of the military or that it's someone from the human race whose been floating around out there for three years?

She just said "Fleet" - there were humans on board the cylon basestar so ... maybe she wasn't joking when she told Roslyn she was a cylon

[John P. Glynn]

Possibly ... but I hope not. I hope it's someone nobody's seen.

If the fifth is someone we're already familiar with, it'll be difficult for for the writers to reveal them without it seeming either completely telegraphed (Rosslyn, Baltar, Adama) or totally contrived (Duallo, Gaeta, Helo).

[hixx]

I love the idea that it might be Roslin, and that she's not the dying leader at all...Baltar is.

Or...I think it could totally be Baltar, because didn't he get through to the Six's mind? Like she was doing to him?

Did I dream that?


Hixx

[Arnie]

I think its going to be Doc Cottle.

Or someone dead, like Billy or Calee (or however you spell it).

[Telfer]

The only reason Tory is a cylon is because it was originally supposed to be Billy and they had to write him out of the show for being an annoying actor. I remember reading several stories about that... I could be wrong though- clearly I don't even know when this show is going to be alive or dead.

I could buy it being Callie, or another dead person. Callie would make her and Tyroll's child more unique as it would be the first and only Cylon-Cylon baby.

I think D'Anna's comment about the final one not being in the fleet was a huge hint. They wouldn't fuck a line up like that. It's got to be Rosalin, Baltar, Helo, or someone else in that rescue party that was on that Basestar when she made the comment. Helo would also muck up who the real half human half cylon child is. It would also explain Hera's dreams of Six and general vacant-eyed schizo behavior. Maybe she's acting like a hybrid or has a weird personality because she's bred from two cylons. I've kind of suspected Helo since he and Athena first got stranded together.

Cottle would be my favorite guess otherwise. He's such a great character, often embodying old school ideals and mannerisms of humanity. It would be so fitting. But I think it's been narrowed down for us.

[sammy]

http://forums.millarworld.tv/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=1805

[schaefe]

Well, at Dragon Con, Edward James Olmos asked for a show of hands...

"Who thinks that Adama's a cylon?"

About maybe a dozen out of about 500 people raised their hands.

"Who thinks that Adama's not a cylon?"

Everyone raises their hands.

"Man, are you people in for a surprise."

It was cool that Aaron Douglas (Tyrol) showed up in his Chief's flight deck costume from the show....

[Telfer]

Well, at Dragon Con, Edward James Olmos asked for a show of hands...

"Who thinks that Adama's a cylon?"

About maybe a dozen out of about 500 people raised their hands.

"Who thinks that Adama's not a cylon?"

Everyone raises their hands.

"Man, are you people in for a surprise."

It was cool that Aaron Douglas (Tyrol) showed up in his Chief's flight deck costume from the show....

Interesting!

That would be a lame way for EJO to blow the whole surprise, wouldn't it? Doing a roll call at a convention and just tipping the show's biggest hand?

Aaron Douglas rules.

[Chip]

I was just watching the second episode of Season 2. In the episode, Starbuck and Helo, back on New Caprica, return to Starbucks apartment. She puts in a CD (their version of a CD) and piano music begins to play. I think it's the same music that plays during all those shots in season 4 of the Cylons on their Basestar. So that would be an interesting way to hint that she's the final Cylon.

Also, Helo says (in reference to the music playing) "That's not you."

And Kara's response is, "It's my dad".

So who knows. But interesting, nonetheless. When do the new episodes start?!? :(

-Chip

[schaefe]

Aaron Douglas rules.

He does. The other cast members praised him for being the first cast members to start going to 'Cons right after the mini-series. Olmos singled him out as one of the builders of the initial fanbase before the series started.

Everyone on the cast kind of poo-pooed the whole 'Con idea, but he started dragging the other cast members along. "These are our fans! If it wasn't for them, we wouldn't be working on this show at all."

Timoe then interrupted Douglas by saying: "Plus, you guys throw some wicked awesome parties!"

[Chip]

So I was re-watching the season 2 episode, Downloaded, and it occurred to me, how clearly Baltar is the final Cylon.

Because on Caprica, when the nuclear explosion hit, Caprica Six dies of the explosion, and is downloaded into a new body and resurrected.

Thinking about it, I'm pretty surethe same thing happened to Baltar. He died in the explosion, too. This isn't Indiana Jones, and Six's body did not shield him from a nuclear explosion.

So the final five have some sort of secret Rez facility on Caprica and Baltar rezzed. And he has a blank spot in his memory for it.

In fact, perhaps dying in such close proximity during the nuke scrambled the downloads of Six and Baltar, which is why they appear in each other's heads.

[Telfer]

Eh, I don't know about that. He would ressurect on the ship, then. Like Six. But instead he was in the melee on Caprica's surface mere minutes later. Unless they reveal a secret underground resurrection chamder on Caprica (which would throw out the entire last season's arc about the rez ship) I don't think he died in the explosion.

Final Cylon, maybe. But not rezzed on Caprica.

[sammy]

just a reminder, the webisodes are up.

[sammy]

...and some info on the post-series TV movie. (http://io9.com/5112884/more-of-the-same-but-different-in-bsg-movie)

[Chip]

just a reminder, the webisodes are up.

The first three webisodes are up, you mean. As in, not all of them, like I thought.

Donnez moi BSG!

[sammy]

Remember this pic?

http://scenescreen.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/battlestar-galactica_lastsupper.jpg

someone lined up the water glasses and...

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk8/DustyButt300C/BSGAnswers.jpg?t=1229699699

[Chip]

I just watched the commentary for season 1 episodes and I have to say it wasn't as insightful as I expected. The guys talk a lot about production, which I guess isn't too surprising because they're producers. But I was hoping for more discussion of character and actors. There was some, but not as much as I was hoping for. They talked about their directors a decent amount, and how each had their own style. But there was not one mention of the music they used except for the season 1 finale, when they talked about the music they didn't use. And that was something I really wanted to hear more about, because the music works so well in the show.

Also, they talk way too much about stuff. By that, I mean they spend 5 minutes on one thing that could be explained in 30 seconds, and in the meantime, they pass up discussing four or five other subjects. Ironically, one subject they talk too much about is their lack of exposition, and how they expect the audience to "get" what's going on.

Another thing that surprised me was their discussion of the season 1 finale. (SPOILERS for that episode coming next).

Specifically, they hadn't had the idea of the crib being in the opera house until late in the production process. (originally it was going the be Dirk Benedict that Baltar meets, and Dirk declares "I am God". Weird, huh?) Also, they didn't know where the Helo-on-Cparica plot line was going to go while they were writing season 1. So the central issue in the series of the human/cylon baby was an on-the-fly creation. Did they drop whatever they were going to do or weave the baby in? It seems like such a major thing to change mid-stream.

When does season 5 start? :)

[Forsythe]

When does season 5 start? :)

You mean the second half of season 4. But I get what you mean; it feels as if we've waiting so long that these final 10 episodes are their own season.

I believe it's Friday, Jan 16th, 9pm CST.

[Chip]

Ah, yes, that is indeed what I mean.

Another gripe I have with the commentaries/podcasts - Ron Moore talks more about what they didn't do that what they did.

It seems like every episode/scene/shot he takes the whole time talking about a first draft or a different way they were going to take it, and very infrequently on what we're actually seeing. I'm a lot more interested in the latter than the former. There's probably a reason they changed it to the finished product, and usually that reason is quality.

OK, bitching over. Countdown Jan 16 is on!

[sammy]

I'm doing my damndest to dodge spoilers.

Sadly, I have to wait until the next day to catch this each time since I don't have Sci Fi :(

[Chip]

Well, Frak.

[sammy]

Trib article (http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/entertainment_tv/2009/01/final-fifth-cylon-ellen-tigh-battlestar-galactica-dualla-dee-.html) with interviews with writers/producers/etc of season premier.

Just when you thought BSG couldn't get any darker, you get an ep like last night...

[sammy]

http://i190.photobucket.com/albums/z43/ndskadsen/battlestar/frackearth.jpg

[man.D.ble]

The thing that really hit me was the whole Dee event. I thought she was going to try and make things work with Apollo again, but then WHAM!

And the Thirteenth Tribe remains (bodies). Shocking, yet I think this is the beginning of how everything first started on Kobol in the first place.

If we take a look at the timeline, it as 4,000 years ago the Thirteenth Tribe left Kobol, then 2,000 year ago the Twelve Colonies leave as well. I think it has to do with someone coming back from Earth 2,000 or so years ago and that person being the jealous god who casued the Kobol departure.

Doesn't sound like much, but just think about it. LoL.

[Chip]

OK, so now that people have had a chance to see the season premier, let's talk a bit.

SPOILERS of course.


Well, we now know that Ellen is the last model of Cylon. I have to admit, that is a weird choice. I'll reserve judgement until I see how it plays out, but as of right now, I don't like her as a Cylon. I don't like her as a Cylon because she's such a human antagonist. To me she represented the vices of humanity, and to make her a Cylon ruins that. So, they better have a good reason for it.

And where does that leave Kara? She finds her dead body in the viper, so are there just more than 12 models? Is she something else, like a hybrid?

And what of the opera house visions?

Should be an interesting rest of the season/series...

[timalimdim]

More Spoilers here, I guess.

So, a couple of questions/ideas. Maybe these things have been covered here or elsewhere.

So... Earth was settled by Cylons. Are... we? Cylons? Maybe I'm way off base.

Also, as far as Starbuck goes, just because conventional wisdom on the show states that there are 12 Cylons, does that mean that number is set in stone? Could there not be a 13th cylon, off by itself, just as there is a 13th colony away from the other 12? It'd be nice symmetry, but I'm sure many fans would call it a cop-out.

I'm not crazy about Ellen being #12, but I'm all ears. We'll see how it plays.

[sammy]

I think Ellen and Sol will have a time-spanning, deeply entwined love story--which is why they were together despite their problems (during this go 'round).

I was fine with her as a pick...as long as the writers give me a good pay off.

[timalimdim]

I think Ellen and Sol will have a time-spanning, deeply entwined love story--which is why they were together despite their problems (during this go 'round).

I was fine with her as a pick...as long as the writers give me a good pay off.

So I am finally going to be forced to watch The Fountain.

[Chip]

I think Ellen and Sol will have a time-spanning, deeply entwined love story--which is why they were together despite their problems (during this go 'round).

Like Hancock?

Also, it says in the credits that there are 12 Cylon models. I'm taking that as fact. It would feel like a cop out to just add a 13th. Of course, the two halfbreed babies are kind of Cylons, I guess. And the Tigh/Six potential baby. So I don't know what they're doing.

[Chip]

Hotdog, you sly dog!

[robbersean]

Felix Gaeta, who'd 'a' thunk it.

This was such an incredibly tense episode. I honestly got a little stressed out. I really hate waiting a week to watch new BSG episodes.

So, I guess the question is, how does this all play out? Do Adama and Tigh get control of Galactica? If they do, are they going to execute ALL of those crew members who sided with Benedict Gaeta (like Racetrack? And all of those Marines)? Will Zarek get his comeuppance? Will all of the good guys escape to the Basestar and 'port away? Or will Cavil show up and render all of these arguments moot.

With the rate at which characters die on this show, I really wonder how many will be left at the end.

[Chip]

I never thought I could be mad at Gaeta, and now I am furious!

Tense is a good word for this episode. I don't know how they're going to figure this shit out.

That seems to be a sentiment for several shows I'm watching these days.

[sammy]

Wowsers.

At this point I could see so many folks getting snuffed. And, while I would be pissed, I could totally buy into anyone eating it at this point.

Poor Laird. First his family gets shot for disobeying orders and then he gets wrenchmurdered for sticking to chain of command.

I'm just hoping anyone who's a filthy skinjob lover gets "deported" to the rebel basestar and it becomes the last, best hope for humanity/cylonity. I can see the basestar threatening to take the fleet out if the final four aren't returned and sympathetic humans allowed exodus.

Then I can see Cavel and Co. jumping in and wiping out the fleet... which I would frakkin' love.

[sammy]

Also, one of my favorite moments:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3355/3240850583_6855637eb5_o.jpg

[man.D.ble]

I have to watch the eps a day after since I come home right as the ep is ending. Anyways, after seeing "The Oath", I am truely shocked at all of this. I am hoping Ellen comes out of nowhere and lays the smack down on all of their candy asses. Why Gaida, why? And I don't want Athena to get raped. Please, please don't let that happen.

But after seeing what is in store for next week all I can say is that Roslin best be steppin up to them haters.

[JRC]

Don't "skinjobs" have superstrength? I mean, 6 and Leoben at least, have demonstrated that. Do the others have it as well?

[robbersean]

We know for sure that the first seven Cylons have superstrength, speed, etc. but I don't know if the final five do. They are, after all, "fundamentally different Cylons" whatever the frak that means.

[Forsythe]

We know for sure that the first seven Cylons have superstrength, speed, etc. but I don't know if the final five do. They are, after all, "fundamentally different Cylons" whatever the frak that means.

I would think so only because Tory rocketed Cally pretty damn far when she hit her with a single swing in the airlock.

[sammy]

quick little continuity note:

Remember Capt. Kelley, our favorite LSO on the viper launching pad? Who later tried killing Baltar and was imprisoned?

That's him leading the marines going after the Raptor at the end.

Oh, Capt. Kelley...

also, the podcast is now up...

http://www.scifi.com/battlestar/downloads/podcast.php

[Chip]

Well, pretty satisfying conclusion to the mutiny story arc.

There was no gray area on that one, not when Zarek had the quorum shot. But that's ok with me (the lack of gray area), because it was cool to see the good guys win one.

What did Tyrol see with the ripped metal on the wall at the end there? Anyone catch the significance of that?

-Chip

[sammy]

re: engine room

Maybe Galactica is reaching the end of the line. I wouldn't be surprised if it's some sort of damage that limits what they can do or how far they can go when it comes to jumping...or even staying operational.

[man.D.ble]

re: engine room

Maybe Galactica is reaching the end of the line. I wouldn't be surprised if it's some sort of damage that limits what they can do or how far they can go when it comes to jumping...or even staying operational.

Judging by the marks I think it must be from a cylon robot loose on board or something else. Those cracks look like it was done by a sharp tool of some kind.

[sammy]

I'm going with crazy stress/metal fatigue.

[Chip]

I'm going with crazy stress/metal fatigue.

I think you might be right. Galactica isn't going to be able to keep jumping any more.

They're going to have to split up the fleet to try to find a place to live, and it's going to be 12 groups, so 12 new colonies. And the 13th colony will be the basestar with its cylons and some humans and cylon/human babies.

[BWo]

I think you might be right. Galactica isn't going to be able to keep jumping any more.

They're going to have to split up the fleet to try to find a place to live, and it's going to be 12 groups, so 12 new colonies. And the 13th colony will be the basestar with its cylons and some humans and cylon/human babies.

I think it's heading that way too.

In regards to the damage on Galactica, I'm pretty sure it was the first ship to be fitted with the Cylon Jump Drive and Tyrol said that the Sixes, Leobens, and Boomers have the ability to install it. This makes me think that the Cylons could be trying to sabotage Galactica. Or it's some pretty bad-ass Mynoks looking to suck on some power cables.

[sammy]

I think it's as simple as metal fatigue. This season, the Bucket has been shown as noticeably more battered and beat down--rust on the bulkheads, worn down fittings, etc.

No jump upgrades have been made yet, that's what inspired the mutiny.

[man.D.ble]

I don't think it is metal fatigue due to the number of cracks and how the cracks were placed. However, I do agree that Galactica won't be jumping anymore due to all the damage from over the years and not being repaired properly.